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- 09/01/14

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 COMMENT 549724 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 07:34 PM

Google service dog fraud. Did this after an encounter at the SBCC track, which is posted no dogs allowed, when a young woman came in with a dog and met up with her boyfriend. She claimed it was a service dog and basically said "you can't stop me", to a SBCC employee and to me. Neither dog nor woman had characteristics I've noticed in service dog-human pairs before. It did not seem legit.

Al least now I know to ask what service the dog is trained to perform.

Partial Definition from CFR
Service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. [...]
The crime deterrent effects of an animalĀ“s presence and the provision of emotional support, well-being, comfort, or companionship do not constitute work or tasks for the purposes of this definition.

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 AQUAHOLIC helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 07:26 PM

Couldn't this whole matter be resolved if all dogs who provide either care, therapy, service, etc., be required to wear either a tag/vest or other identifier? I'm sure you would have a few 'counterfeit' tags/vests show up, but at least there would be some standard. Why would anyone be adverse to their dog helper wearing some I.D.? Seems like it would be less hassle all around.

Met a 'therapy' dog (wink-wink) at the Ahwahnee Hotel last xmas that wore only a bandana around it's neck...they gave it the run of the place...lol. I could care less, I love dogs.

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 COMMENT 549720 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 07:08 PM

So far on average I run into a person/situation with a service dog once every 28.5 years. I'm not too worried about dog butt on my chair in a restaurant, far worse- hence unmentionable- has sat on that chair. There's a good reason why " The Life Of A Chair Seat" never made it to the big screen.

If a crackhead on Amtrak, the New Greyhound, wants to get his bush companion onboard for a ride, who cares. It's a big city problem, weirdos on the public transpo. At least the guy went straight to the booze car. Blends in a little more and he's somewhat expected to be there, like graffiti in the bus terminal. Luckily, the bartender isn't expected to have any doggie treats on hand. Call me cynical. The glass is half empty. Check it out, it's more than half empty and he's ordering another.

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 COMMENT 549709P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 05:45 PM

Lizbeth - Your use is perfect & that's what I've always assumed a service dog did.

I still have a problem with the little, Fifi-type, white poodles & chihuahuas I see being snuck into all sorts of establishments (lots of restaurants in large hand bags) & when discovered the "It's my service dog" response is used.

As people have mentioned here, what about the many people with severe allergies &/or just a fear of dogs due to a bad experience in their life?

What about the lack of them in numerous foreign countries? How do those people cope sans service dog? They seem to quite well.

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 LIZBETH helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 05:02 PM

623/681 ... That may be how management required you to act, but it wasn't correct, or legal. I do have a service dog, I'm hearing impaired and she alerts me to various things, fire alarms, doorbell, etc. I did obtain a doctor's letter and a health certificate to fly with her, and she has a vest and ID tag, but I'm not required to have or display any of those. They are mostly to prevent being hassled by folks who aren't aware of the ADA laws. And yes, there are lots of people abusing the system, and it likely will be more heavily regulated, unfortunate for all of us (blind/deaf/impaired/diabetic/seizure-prone/PTSD/memory-challenged) whose service animals improve the quality of our lives.

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 COMMENT 549704P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 04:48 PM

Because of the amount of abuse of this issue, regulations are being revamped. It's too bad people abuse priviledges.

All dogs in public should be capable of behaving appropriately. That includes quietly staying with their owners. If people required their pets (and children) to be polite and not disruptive, they would be welcome in many places. As it is, many dogs are allowed to wander, jump on people, bark, get in other dogs' space, jump on furniture, urinate on plants, etc. Soon, many public places that permit dogs will eliminate that privilege.

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 COMMENT 549701P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 04:32 PM

From ada.gov:

2. Q: What is a service animal?

A: The ADA defines a service animal as any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to provide assistance to an individual with a disability. If they meet this definition, animals are considered service animals under the ADA regardless of whether they have been licensed or certified by a state or local government.
Service animals perform some of the functions and tasks that the individual with a disability cannot perform for him or herself. Guide dogs are one type of service animal, used by some individuals who are blind. This is the type of service animal with which most people are familiar.

10. Q: What if a service animal barks or growls at other people, or otherwise acts out of control?

A: You may exclude any animal, including a service animal, from your facility when that animal's behavior poses a direct threat to the health or safety of others. For example, any service animal that displays vicious behavior towards other guests or customers may be excluded. You may not make assumptions, however, about how a particular animal is likely to behave based on your past experience with other animals. Each situation must be considered individually.
Although a public accommodation may exclude any service animal that is out of control, it should give the individual with a disability who uses the service animal the option of continuing to enjoy its goods and services without having the service animal on the premises.

More at above site.

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 SHARE helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 04:03 PM

I have been to Europe many times. I have even lived there when I was a child. I have never seen dogs in restaurants or on any kind of public transportation. What part of Europe were you in? I think the idea of a service dog would be laughable in Europe. Just my personal opinion but I can't imagine that happening in most parts of Europe.

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 COMMENT 549694 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 03:55 PM

I used to like dogs. But now I am dog averse because I have experienced so many nasty tempered or poorly behaved dogs who have intruded on my space, hygiene and safety and finding that they are usually owned by even more obnoxious or oblivious owners.

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 REX OF SB helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 03:49 PM

One afternoon I was sitting in the wall booth nearest the front door at Harry's, when an overdressed Los Angeles-esque young lady and her boyfriend came in with a small, neurotic, extremely hyperactive dog, which they tried to pass off as a service dog. When the hostess remarked that it certainly wasn't behaving like a service dog, the lady replied that it was "in training." When a server leaned down slightly to look at the dog, it jumped up and tried to bite her. I think it also might have peed a little.

The faux service dog was denied entrance, prompting the outraged owner to say she would sue Harry's for discriminating against a service dog. Seeing that I was paying close attention to the kerfuffle (I always like a bit of cabaret with my Omaha sandwich and Mai Tai) the hostess asked me if I'd write an account of what had just happened, in case they did get sued. I was happy to oblige.

I agree with @620 that the regulations governing service and comfort animals need to be tightened. Someone trying to pass off a "regular" dog as a service animal is only a notch or two above an abled person parking in a handicap space.

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 COMMENT 549690P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 03:29 PM

Hey 676, no need to be snarky here.

The whole idea of this thread is to hopefully educate many,& probably you too, about service dogs vs comfort pets. Easy

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 COMMENT 549684 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 02:53 PM

Dog is my co pilot!

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 COMMENT 549683 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 02:25 PM

THE BARRON As I understand it (and I may be wrong) but a service animal is one who works with an individual owner, for his or her assistance. A comfort animal (dogs, cats and bunnies!) are loving well trained animals that visit aged, ill or terminal patients, to give them joy and comfort.

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 COMMENT 549681 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 02:01 PM

624 and 625...623 here! Hate to burst your bubble, but that is exactly How management at the Goleta shelter has us handle it during my employment at SBCAS from 12/2008 to 02/2011!

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 COMMENT 549679 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 01:44 PM

Sometimes I wish I was sitting next to or in front of a pitbull instead of the loud knuckleheads on the train.

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 FLICKA helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 01:42 PM

When seeing-eye dogs were 1st used it took an act of Congress to have them allowed on transportation and other public places.

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 SITHSNOOPY helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 01:27 PM

Dogs can indeed help people with anxiety issues. They can also let someone know when they are about to have a seizure.

I do not need a service dog. But it would be fun to occasionally take my dog to work. But it might be a bit difficult: one is hyper, but very friendly... but he jumps. He's gotten better about it, but he's big, and people don't need to get flattened by him! The other is old, mellow, and friendly, but it might hurt his legs trying to get up the stairs.

One guy who used to work at my company would bring in his dog. He would rescue the sweetest pit bulls. I never felt in any kind of danger. I've been fortunate and have only met non-stereotypical pit bulls, and good pit bull owners. :)

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 THE BARRON helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 01:23 PM

Great story, 667

Now, I have no clue what the difference is between a "service dog" & a "comfort dog."

We have an amazing comfort cat & he's the best, and stays home 24/7.

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 COMMENT 549667 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:54 PM

I know that a true service dog is not allowed to interact with the public, because it's whole focus is to be on the person it's helping, so I never approach one. However a woman was in line at the Costco pharmacy behind me, with a service dog, and I complimented her on it's behavior. She said she was a comfort dog, and I could pet her. I reached down, and the owner gave her a command. The sweet dog came up go me and leaned on me and let me pet her! When we were done interacting the owner gave another command, and the dog returned to her side. She said she visits hospice, hospitals and such. How nice! She thanked me for not just reaching down without asking.

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 MACPUZL helpful negative off topic

Mars, Saturn, And Moon

2014-09-01 12:46 PM

Nice shots.

It was Saturn to upper *right*, and Mars to lower *left*. If you keep watching the pair of planets, Mars will be pulling away leftward (eastward) from Saturn over the coming weeks.

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 SHOREBIRD helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:27 PM

-649
Had a similar incident on an airplane. Woman with little mutt "service dog" allowed her dog to run free in the cabin and walk ON the passengers in seats adjacent to hers.

Man in business suit next to her was unhappy with a dog in his lap. He pushed the dog onto the floor and the lady started yelling at him.

Apparently her service dog was trained to allow her to be a jerk.

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 COMMENT 549661P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:26 PM

Yes. Dog averse people are everywhere: On trains, in cafes, on buses, on planes, in shops, in supermarkets. It can't be helped. I think they should wear tags, so that the dog owners can easily identify these people as Dog Averse.

That way, dog owners can politely and judiciously avoid any potentially disagreeable encounters. Hopefully this will be satisfactory to the Dog Averse individuals. One never knows, however, as Dog Averse people can be very vocal, irritable, and often stick their noses in where not wanted. They can be found barking out their disapproval and then demanding special attention. Tags would go a long way toward keeping the peace.

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 COMMENT 549660 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:25 PM

I rode Amtrak one time with a young man who was attended by a 'service cat'. It was caged, but he let it out a couple of times.
After a while it became obvious that he was mentally challenged.

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 COMMENT 549657 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:17 PM

At least he was on his way out of town.

And what about humans that are allergic to dogs? What protections do they have?

And what about the poor dogs that are allergic to humans? Poor little guys sneezing and sneezing. Seen plenty of those too.

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 ROGER DODGER helpful negative off topic

Mars, Saturn, And Moon

2014-09-01 12:14 PM

"Shooting the Moon" Reminds me of hazing in military school...

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 COMMENT 549655 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:13 PM

I want a "service monkey". when I go to a bar I'll ask my monkey to jump over the counter and pour me a drink. Life is sweet!

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 THE BARRON helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 12:02 PM

Barron here -

The "service dog" incident at Amtrak ended with the guy getting extremely vocal towards the station person on the platform.

He did board with the dog much to the chagrin of many on board. We noticed the families with small children & a few elderly folks muttering comments & rolling eyes as he walked the aisle looking for a seat.

Fortunately, he ended up far from us & the families, in of all places, the Cafe Car. Go figure

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 COMMENT 549650P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:52 AM

An able-bodied, healthy, hearty acquaintance had a dog, her pet, that she'd take everywhere. Unleashed. When entering Big 5 with the dog, a clerk told her dogs were prohibited. Her glib reply, "He's my service dog." To which the clerk, incredulous, asked, "He helps you walk?"

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 COMMENT 549649P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:43 AM

I sat next to a young woman and her "service dog" on a flight from LAX to the Boston airport. She was returning to college on the east coast from her home in Alaska. I didn't mind, but it sure seemed fishy. I asked what service the dog provided, and she said it warned her when she was getting anxious. (Actually, the dog seemed more anxious than the owner.)

I believe service dogs need to have a certificate for flights and proof of at least a rabies vaccination. I don't know if this woman had either.

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 COMMENT 549648 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:39 AM

Call county animal control and ask what the process is! 681-5285-SB, 934-6119-SM, OR Lompoc 737-7755

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 COMMENT 549646P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:31 AM

this was a comment about helicopters which is better suited for this topic.
Here you go, all the accurate information you need. By the way, I have a service dog and we ride Amtrak and like every other place he goes, my service dog always wears identification that states that he is a service dog and also that people shouldn't just come up and pet him.

U.S. Department of Justice
Civil Rights Division
Disability Rights Section

COMMONLY ASKED QUESTIONS ABOUT SERVICE ANIMALS IN PLACES OF BUSINESS

1. Q: What are the laws that apply to my business?

A: Under the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA), privately owned businesses that serve the public, such as restaurants, hotels, retail stores, taxicabs, theaters, concert halls, and sports facilities, are prohibited from discriminating against individuals with disabilities. The ADA requires these businesses to allow people with disabilities to bring their service animals onto business premises in whatever areas customers are generally allowed.
2. Q: What is a service animal?

A: The ADA defines a service animal as any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to provide assistance to an individual with a disability. If they meet this definition, animals are considered service animals under the ADA regardless of whether they have been licensed or certified by a state or local government.
Service animals perform some of the functions and tasks that the individual with a disability cannot perform for him or herself. Guide dogs are one type of service animal, used by some individuals who are blind. This is the type of service animal with which most people are familiar. But there are service animals that assist persons with other kinds of disabilities in their day-to-day activities. Some examples include:
_ Alerting persons with hearing impairments to sounds.

_ Pulling wheelchairs or carrying and picking up things for persons with mobility impairments.

_ Assisting persons with mobility impairments with balance.

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 COMMENT 549641 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:17 AM

I have never encountered such a scenario. The regulations are basically non-existent except that it's a misdemeanor to falsely claim that ones dog is a service, emotional or support dog. I have suspected that the woman with the poodle in her purse wasn't disabled, but I can't ask if it was true. In Feb. this year the State Legislature opened hearings into the issue of fake service dogs, fake disabled people.

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 COMMENT 549640 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:09 AM

Service Dogs are different from therapy dogs. Service Dogs are regulated by the Americans with disabilities act or ADA. Service dogs must be trained to preform a specific task for someone who is legally disabled. You are only allowed to ask what task the service dog preforms and you can be fined up to fifty thousand for refusing service to a legitimate service dog covered by the ADA. Therapy dogs are completely different however. They are not regulated and anyone who feels that they benefit from a therapy dog may have one. You are not required by law to provide services to someone with a therapy dog.

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 COMMENT 549639 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:08 AM

614 is right. The only legal question is to inquire what the animal (not necessarily a dog) is trained to do. No tags or certifications required. Beyond that the only reason to exclude the animal from a public place is if the animal creates a disruption (peeing, barking, biting, etc.) I work in a setting where, in my view, people consistently abuse this right. Of course I am biased: it creeps me out to see dogs sitting on restaurant chairs or in grocery carts that other humans will use later... but that's just me.
Privileges are also extended without inquiry to people with claimed disabilities. Want to avoid the lines at amusement parks? Rent a wheelchair at the entrance, have a seat and you and your companions will be shown to the head of the line, no questions asked.

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 COMMENT 549638 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 11:06 AM

In Europe dogs go on busses, subways,trams, restaurants, etc. It's very nice to see them out with their families. I have never seen a bad dog, or a dog mess. Maybe their people are better trained.

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 COMMENT 549634P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:53 AM

630 - that is totally beside the point. People who have legitimate service animals - and ESA (Emotional Service Animals) are not allowed in food establishments - have enough problems without people who fake it because they don't want to leave their pets at home just make life more difficult for them. No, I do not have a service dog. I do however have a dog and would not consider taking him where he is not allowed to go.

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 COMMENT 549631 helpful negative off topic

Mars, Saturn, And Moon

2014-09-01 10:33 AM

from shoreline park it was spectacular!

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 COMMENT 549630 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:32 AM

was the dog or the guy bothering you?

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 COMMENT 549629P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:30 AM

Maybe the 'service dog' should get a placard/tag similar to the one issued for the cars of disabled people? If they don't get one already.

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 COMMENT 549627 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:27 AM

some people need service dogs for emotional reasons not just physical. i agree it is abused a lot!! its sad for the people who actually do need them.

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 COMMENT 549625 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:23 AM

623: Totally incorrect. All dogs are required to be licensed, but there is no special license or certificate for a service dog.

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 COMMENT 549624 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:20 AM

623: you're making things up.

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 COMMENT 549623 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:15 AM

Service dogs are by law required to be licensed through the city (or county, if residing outside city limits). It requires that the owner sign a legal document known as an affidavit or provide a letter from their physician. Once those 2 things are completed, the owner of the dog receives an additional tag shaped like the state of California, which the service dog must wear (along with license tag). Unfortunately for those who truly need a service dog, many people use the system to force local landlords, restaurants, and other establishments to accept them bringing their dog(s) everywhere with them.

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 COMMENT 549622 helpful negative off topic

Scenes From a Sunday Sunrise in San...

2014-09-01 10:12 AM

Beautiful photos, I liked the fall touch!

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 COMMENT 549620 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:07 AM

Especially here in dog friendly sb, it is out of control. I've seen lots of dogs in costco sometimes eating demos or even relieving themselves. This is gross and the law needs to be changed. I understand that some people need this but the law is being greatly taken advantage of.

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 COMMENT 549616P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 10:00 AM

Amtrak should have managed this way better than they did. Waiting for the story of the outcome, please...

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 COMMENT 549614 helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 09:54 AM

The law provides wide protection to persons with service dogs. The ONLY question you can ask a person who claims that the dog is a service dog is what service the dog is trained to provide. You cannot ask what disability the person has, or whether the dog has any certification that it is a service dog, as that is not required. But you can ask what service the dog is trained to provide to the handler.

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 COMMENT 549611P helpful negative off topic

Service Dogs

2014-09-01 09:44 AM

Mildly impaired folks can have service dogs too. You don't have to be blind or deaf to have a service dog. One should carry a certificate to be able to bring a service dog where other dogs are not permitted.

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 COMMENT 549608 helpful negative off topic

Mars, Saturn, And Moon

2014-09-01 09:34 AM

Charles it's really easy to blow out highlights when shooting the moon. Keep in mind it's lit directly by the sun ... use the sunny 16 rule and ignore your camera's light meter. :-)

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 COMMENT 549600 helpful negative off topic

Mars, Saturn, And Moon

2014-09-01 08:47 AM

Yes around 8:30ish, it was pretty! Glad I jaut happend to look up before I went inside.

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 ROGER DODGER helpful negative off topic

Mars, Saturn, And Moon

2014-09-01 08:19 AM

I did and thought it was Beautiful I missed just about everything else it was nice to see this..

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 COMMENT 549575P helpful negative off topic

Rachel Hoyt Poems

2014-09-01 03:37 AM

I misspoke. Someone will call me out on it, so I'll say if I did drink wine, I might at this point avoid CA wine.

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 COMMENT 549574P helpful negative off topic

Rachel Hoyt Poems

2014-09-01 03:32 AM

451, are you going to stop eating vegetables? Be sure to check the labels for those imported from Mexico, Chile, etc. It's a difficult trade off, transport pollution/carbon vs. CA water use. Of course I'm not going to stop eating vegetables, but meat uses MUCH more water than plants to feed us. I'm not a vegetarian. And I don't drink wine, especially CA wine.

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